Hypothermia Detection?

Now that I've come clean about frequently getting sick after cold water sessions, I do have a couple of questions that maybe someone can answer. I have made quite an effort this last year to really get myself in shape, as I've written. My bodyfat composition has been halved, in the middle teens, as is common with people who run a lot. So I am not nearly as tolerant to cold water as I used to be.

This is ironic. I have found that the lighter and more athletic I am, the better I surf. But, I get the 'shivers' much more quickly than I used to...and I don't mean just minor shivering, I am talking about violent shivering and almost uncontrolled. Sometimes I shiver so violently I have trouble climbing out of the water.

What has not changed since I was obese is that I sweat massively. This comes from paddling and if it is sunny, I may sweat under my hood. Both sweating and shivering cause very quick loss of body heat.

You can get hypothermia in 80F water, even in Hawaii. But it comes much more quickly in cold water.
http://hypothermia.org/images/timegraph.gif

From a page on hypothermia: 'Hypothermia is defined as a body core temperature less than 35 degrees Celsius. Decreased consciousness occurs when the core temperature falls to approximately 32 to 30 degrees. '

My equipment is suitable for cold water, usually a 6/5/4 and I recently invested in 6mm boots and gloves. I also wear a polypropelene rash guard.

The wind gets me wicked cold, too. And despite the recommendations of trying to remain above water from pages I've read about hypothermia, it is remaining above water in a 40 mph wind and below zero wind chill factor that seems to do me in.

I have had pneumonia and I have bronchitis, so maybe I am more prone to get cold than other people. So my questions are:

1) How can I tell if I am I am getting hypothermia, which is possible even in a short session?

2) Should I invest in even thicker equipment? But if I do so, might this not cause me to sweat through my head even more, causing me to lose heat?

3) A recommendation on some of these pages is that you need to hydrate. I have in the past brought along a water bottle. But wouldn't drinking fluids make you even colder??

This is not meant to be a joke. I do surf as much as possible, despite my local conditions in the Great Lakes.

Thanks. craig

Hypothermia is often difficult to detect by oneself. Someone observing you may notice lethargy, slurred speech, and an inablity to make rational decisions or perform simple motor skills. Hypothermia will cause constriction of periphral vasculature (to conserve the vital body core heat) thus the increased kidney filtration rate and urge to urinate when you're cold. Moderate fluid intake is ok and will increase your circulation as long as it isn't a diuretic (coffee or any other caffinated beverages). Cold fluids don't really effect your internal temp that much, but, it would probably be preferable to ingest something warm. I would think that increased wetsuit thickness offers a deminishing rate of return.

A few suggestions:
http://www.vnh.org/ and do a search for 'hypothermia' . Quite good regarding symptoms and effects, http://www.vnh.org/FSManual/20/03Hypothermia.html in particular. Including;

'The following paragraphs discuss the treatment of the semiconscious, unconscious, or apparently dead victim.'

Also.... the polypro underneath the suit. While body temp will push moisture away from the body and through the polypro, broadly speaking...if it has somewhere to go. But your suit is watertight, for all intents and purposes, so the water/sweat, what have you, is still next to your skin, conducting heat away quite nicely, like 26 times as well as air. Have a look through http://www.wiggys.com/html/archives.html for some experimental stuff that was done with underclothing for use with a dry suit. Involved a cotton layer outside the polypro..Interesting stuff.

Doc.....

snip (take THAT Neal... :^)

my signals are 1. my fingers get floppy when I swim, I can't hold them in position.

usually head in. The times that I haven't, the next signal is a general lethargy, find myself not responding to sets, either aggressively or really caring. It's a strange phenom, but time to get out. I judge how long I push it upon how easily I can warm up once I'm out. If it's cold out, I don't even push to stage 1 as often I'll get that cold post-session.

Had hypothermia and a touch of frostbite once on Vancouver Island, but it was a rowing race in a December- not surf related. That was miserable, if I had had the power to declare war on Canada, I would have.

I've gotten cold quite often, though nothing as extreme as you do to surf, but I never get sick. Must be the salt water treatment.

Bro... 40 mph, zero wind chill, fresh water wind swell,violent shivering,getting sick after a sesh...thicker equipment is not the answer! MOVE!!! (I know you're working on it)...

Clues that I have been out too long in cold H20 are prollems with speech, losing coordination, loss of feel...your violent shivering could be a clue... If you are getting that cold, you could easily throw your back out or have a muscle or groin tear...big time loss of T.O.W. Short of moving you could try niacin and/or capsicum (cayenne)extract. Some of the cardiovascular benefits of cayenne includes: Reduced Blood Pressure, because cayenne dilates the blood vessels and allows increased blood circulation. Cayenne also fights fatigue, because the increased circulation lowers the blood pressure and increases the distribution of oxygen. Another product that wicks moisture better than polypro,in addition to being warmer, is polar fleece designed for H20 useage layering: http://www.surfingsports.com/mysterioso.asp Or if you do eventually move somewhere warm (or warmer), you can use it instead of neoprene...equivalent warmth factor is 1.5mm...blocks the wind and has a SPF50 rating...oh, to have those problems, huh? There is a fine line between being hard core and hard up...

WARDOG

Thanks everyone for these suggestions. I will put them to good use while I look for income opportunities elsewhere!

Based upon some of these answers I believe I've already been in early stages of hypothermia. Ice cream headaches are also no fun ;(

But can you imagine having fun riding waves and not noticingfh that you are getting into trouble? That's how it happens for me. craig

Bad day at the ice shelves: http://www.kacm.com/Ch1.jpg (Chicago, IL)

A good Good day might look like: http://www.kacm.com/GLSA2.jpg (Ferrysburg Pier, Michigan)

For knee durablility I would highly recommend Natilus ham curls and ab/adductions. The idea is to strengthen the muscles supporting the knee. Works great.

I am so busy in the winter you can have some of my left over stuff: xc classic ski, xc skate ski locally or at resorts if no snow, also there is Alpine, tele, etc. Not to mention windsurfing on snow and ice sailing at Williams Bay (very dangerous IMHO). Also, one zillion local ice skating rinks, but that would be a very hard fall on the knees.

As a very nice Mexican lady once told me about surfing and these other sports 'Its all the same.' I think she is right.

I have committed an athletic sin: I overtrained for running and did so on a small sloped indoor track. This has caused great pain in the tendons behind my left knee. It is not the knee itself that hurts.

This is one reason why I am going nuts not being able to run outdoors because I don't know of a track that isn't boring to run around and doesn't have an uneven slope. I may try some of the local university facilities. I may try Northeastern IL on NW side. I don't like running on a treadmill, even though I just picked one up for mucho dinero, All local winter sports are out for the year until the pain goes away.

Another result is that I am now using the Tom P (of NW IN, maybe you know him) method of surfing...getting to my knees first and not popping up because it hurts too much.

As I have been treadmill running the pain has nearly gone away and done lots of hamstring stretches. But I am actively looking for a 1/4 mile indoor track. Running on those little 1/12 mile small sloped indoor tracks nearly did me in for running and for surfing..for good.

You're right: these sports are all the same..you can't do any of them if your joints hurt. craig

I'll pass on the 'everyone is sick' opening... I did want to add though, that when my son was about the same age as your's he would bring home an incredible amount of rhino viruses from daycare and later school. It seemed that I would catch colds that he didn't catch but would pass on to me anyway.

Also, don't forget the cooler 1/2 full of hot water...it's grrrrreat.

My morning surf checks have become ice shelf checks...soon, very soon.